A dangerous idea....

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stumper
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#11 Post by stumper »

I greatly appreciate all your candor. I will definitely take it under advisement. It is possible that I just drop the idea all together and get another bear lol. I have a while to think about it. Or better yet put the money into getting a better piece of Osage for a self bow

I will say though I am not disappointed at all in my current bows and maybe easy to please. I mean I can tell the finish on the mad dog is nothing to write home about and know that it hits harder than the others. But they all seem smooth to me and fine to me. Your analysis of the aforementioned custom bows sounds wonderful, but I do wonder if I could ever tell the difference.
Nothing clears a troubled mind like shooting a bow.

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Shadowhntr
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#12 Post by Shadowhntr »

I think about every trad person I personally know both deserves and benefits from getting their own version of a "hot rod" bow. I certainly think you'd always be glad you did. I really hope I didn't pour water on your fire, that wasn't my intentions.

The truth is, we all can harvest animals, or poke holes in a target with just about any bow that is of sufficiency. I have a Shakespeare Wonder bow that I bought for $40, and I know with full confidence that bow will take deer, and shoots nicely accurate at the target butt. But it's certainly not what I'd call a top notch bow and I'm certainly not completely satisfied with it. How it feels, cast, the grip...a number of other things , makes it less appealing then my whip as for instance.
Its more about comfort, and the treating and pleasing of ones self to satisfaction. I know for me being very picky, I have had 2 bows in my life that caused me to quit searching and made me so I could have cared less about looking at any other bow as a serious consideration to purchase. I HAD to sell one and the other I recently bought. To cease searching, That is satisfaction, and imo that's the point a person wants to get to, unless of course you are a collector of sorts. Once I figured out what it was I actually needed along with what I wanted, satisfaction took place. That meant finding the "just right" bow type, length, draw weight, mass, grip style, smoothness, speed, accuracy and shootability, and yes finally even looks count. If any one of those things are out of line with our perception of what we really need and want, its hard to impossible to remain satisfied, and inevitably we will buy
(Or make eh Tony?) another bow again and again and again until we get exactly what will FULLY satisfy us..... (with the exception of the filthy rich, and or collectors, who buy for other justifiable reasons.) That's why I encourage those in limbo over the purchase of an upper level bow, to just go ahead and buy one that will fulfill every need, hope, and dream you could ever want. In the end, it actually saves you money and precious time because you cease searching once you are truly satisfied.
Dave...big difference between the Maddog Prairie Predator and the Toelke Whip, I know that much for sure. I really like my Maddog so I worried over if it was going to really be worth it in feel, looks, and performance...it was worth it, it's a big difference.
The element of surprise can never be replaced by persistence.

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Shadowhntr
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#13 Post by Shadowhntr »

I think a number of bowyers now allow test driving their bows...its a bit if shipping expense but not horrible. Might be a thing to consider? I know Mr Toelke started just building a bow as you would want and send it, with the assumption if if you didn't love it, send it back in a sorta twisted way of try before you buy way. I don't think he gets many back! Lol!
The element of surprise can never be replaced by persistence.

Crazynate
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#14 Post by Crazynate »

I have bought really expensive custom bows before that I never even shot before buying. I think I learned the hard way because archery is all about feel. That doesn't mean any top end custom bow is going to feel right for me. There is not a bad bow out there being made in my opinion. They are all good. It trying to find the one that feels right is hard. I started going to all the big shoots and shows test shooting every bow I can get my hand on. This past year at Compton I probably shot 30 different models in 4 days. I keep notes as to what I like and don't like. Paying 600 plus for a bow with pretty woods won't do you any good if it doesn't fit you right. You'll end up like me trying to make a bow fit your style versus having a bow fit your style. It took me 7 years to find the right custom bow for me. I've owned 6 of them and now I keep my 2 best ones ready at all times for hunting. Getting a new bow is exiting and fun just take your time and don't pick a bow 100% in looks or how it shoots for someone else. Just my opinion.
Goodnight Chesty Wherever You Are.

stumper
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#15 Post by stumper »

It is impossible to rain on my parade shadow. It was just a thought I was thinking and I like the idea of putting aside a hundred or so bucks a month and getting something really nice. I like the looks of the toelkes too actually really like the super d. But im still new in the trad world, I don’t know what I truly like better long or recurve. I’ve personally always struggled with satisfaction so I don’t know if any bow will ever satisfy the inch. That’s part of why self bows are so appealing.
Nothing clears a troubled mind like shooting a bow.

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Shadowhntr
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#16 Post by Shadowhntr »

Crazynate wrote:I have bought really expensive custom bows before that I never even shot before buying. I think I learned the hard way because archery is all about feel. That doesn't mean any top end custom bow is going to feel right for me. There is not a bad bow out there being made in my opinion. They are all good. It trying to find the one that feels right is hard. I started going to all the big shoots and shows test shooting every bow I can get my hand on. This past year at Compton I probably shot 30 different models in 4 days. I keep notes as to what I like and don't like. Paying 600 plus for a bow with pretty woods won't do you any good if it doesn't fit you right. You'll end up like me trying to make a bow fit your style versus having a bow fit your style. It took me 7 years to find the right custom bow for me. I've owned 6 of them and now I keep my 2 best ones ready at all times for hunting. Getting a new bow is exiting and fun just take your time and don't pick a bow 100% in looks or how it shoots for someone else. Just my opinion.
Excellent advise. Time, and trial and error were key for me as well. However...its not always possible for individuals to lay hands on a bow. Shooting beforehand reduces risk of a bad match to zero, but then again those who have no way of trying lots of bows of interest will miss out on many fine bows simply because they could not shoot one. Yes it's a bit of a risk to buy without first shooting. But doing my homework with lots of scrutiny and common sense spending much time...both bows that came to be my best evers were bought without prior shooting.
Many quality and confident bowyers are now offering test drives. A great option....
The element of surprise can never be replaced by persistence.

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Shadowhntr
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#17 Post by Shadowhntr »

dahyer wrote:It is impossible to rain on my parade shadow. It was just a thought I was thinking and I like the idea of putting aside a hundred or so bucks a month and getting something really nice. I like the looks of the toelkes too actually really like the super d. But im still new in the trad world, I don’t know what I truly like better long or recurve. I’ve personally always struggled with satisfaction so I don’t know if any bow will ever satisfy the inch. That’s part of why self bows are so appealing.
....and who knows? Your Cadillac could come from a stave like you said earlier. Like what several have eluded to here, we each have our own idea of what the perfect bow is and for our own very personal reasons. That's why we all agree it's really something that in the end you have to figure out for yourself. I well knew what I was looking for because of prior purchases that didn't quite fit the bill for me. Once I knew what I wanted...it helped narrow down the field. Like Nate said...there REALLY aren't too many poor bows out there if you stay away from some of the foreign bows. Here in North America most are really pretty darn good. All depends on what you are wanting in a bow. Earlier I expressed what I wanted, why I wanted, and how I went about it. Now it your turn to make your way to your dream bow.
The element of surprise can never be replaced by persistence.

stumper
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#18 Post by stumper »

Indeed shadow. And while getting into the woods with any bow gives me immense pleasure, the thought that continually comes back to me is bringing something I’ve made into the woods. If anything this thread has made that more clear...... time for more research.
Nothing clears a troubled mind like shooting a bow.

Captainkirk
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#19 Post by Captainkirk »

Dave, one thing I can say with certainty;
For me, anyway, my used Bear bows are a good fit, and even at 50 years old are way better than I am as a shooter...all but one (Tamerlane) purchased for under 200 dollars on eBay or classifieds.
They aren't so pristine that I fear scratching them or anything else, but for less than the down payment on a custom, I have a bow(s) that suit me, shoot well, and make up somewhat of a quaint vintage collection. Not trying to dissuade you if you feel a custom is in your future, only saying that perfectly adequate bows are out there for a fraction of what a custom will cost you.
Are the newer customs faster? You betcha.
Are they better tuned for accuracy? Sure, probably.
Do the exotic woods and finishes look better than a beat-up second hand bow? Undoubtedly.
But, that being said...I am hunting in heavy brush, and limiting my kill shots to less than 20 yards. Are my used bows up to the task? Absolutely. Probably moreso than I am.
Aim small, miss small!

stumper
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Re: A dangerous idea....

#20 Post by stumper »

Captainkirk wrote:Dave, one thing I can say with certainty;
For me, anyway, my used Bear bows are a good fit, and even at 50 years old are way better than I am as a shooter...all but one (Tamerlane) purchased for under 200 dollars on eBay or classifieds.
They aren't so pristine that I fear scratching them or anything else, but for less than the down payment on a custom, I have a bow(s) that suit me, shoot well, and make up somewhat of a quaint vintage collection. Not trying to dissuade you if you feel a custom is in your future, only saying that perfectly adequate bows are out there for a fraction of what a custom will cost you.
Are the newer customs faster? You betcha.
Are they better tuned for accuracy? Sure, probably.
Do the exotic woods and finishes look better than a beat-up second hand bow? Undoubtedly.
But, that being said...I am hunting in heavy brush, and limiting my kill shots to less than 20 yards. Are my used bows up to the task? Absolutely. Probably moreso than I am.
Yeah old bears may indeed get the nod. Been looking at a lot of them. Maybe I can send you a few listings I find interesting and you can tell me your thought on them?
Nothing clears a troubled mind like shooting a bow.

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